Algebra 1 in 6th grade, followed by normal pace

[Anonymous]

^Do you not understand how dual enrollment works? The FCPS post AP classes are cross listed through GMU. The kids get college credit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In addition to statistics, data science is an alternative to calculus. FCPS has Data Science 1 & 2, but offered only at few schools like Falls Church HS

It is better to take Statistics after calculus. AP classes are supposedly algebra based, but they miss the underlying fundamentals.

What is covered in Data science that’s not in other math classes?

Data Science is a equity math alternative for students who may find algebra 2 challenging
"...data science — a mix of math, statistics and computer science without widely agreed upon high school standards. Allowing data science, the universities said, was an “equity issue” that could send more students to college. But it also raised concerns that some teenagers would be channeled into less challenging coursework, limiting their opportunities once they got there."
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/13/us/california-math-data-science-algebra.html

Data Science is a great option for kids who want more math but are not interested in calculus, which is most of the population. . I had Algebra, Geometry, and Algebra II in high school. I didn’t take a math my senior year. I have never had calculus but I have a PhD. I have used and taught advanced statistics without ever having calculus.

There are multiple paths for people in math. Calculus and beyond is not the end all and be all. There is nothing wrong with recognizing that.

My child will most likely be taking Algebra 1 H in 7th grade and will end up taking beyond calculus, he loves math. He has his path and that is great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^Do you not understand how dual enrollment works? The FCPS post AP classes are cross listed through GMU. The kids get college credit.

DC was given college credit for Multivariable GMU DE course.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^Do you not understand how dual enrollment works? The FCPS post AP classes are cross listed through GMU. The kids get college credit.

^College credit earned needs to be accepted as well by the matriculating college. Yes if it is VA instate college. Depends if it is not (mostly not if highly selective private)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:from another thread....

To take Algebra I in 6th grade, the kid must:
Score 145 or higher on the CogAT Quant section
Score a 575 or higher on their 4th grade SOL
have the support of their 4th grade AAP/advanced math teacher.

Then, if they meet all of these at the end of 4th grade, Gatehouse will conduct additional testing. Kids who meet those benchmarks will be jumped up to 6th grade AAP math when in 5th grade.

In 5th grade, they need a 91st percentile or higher score on the IAAT as well as a pass advanced on the 7th grade Math SOL to be eligible for Algebra in 6th grade.
report

What's the evidence for this besides DCUM rumors? Surely if this was policy it would be written down somewhere?

URMs have no visibility into this unwritten process. FCPS has created this convoluted process with ton of hurdles, and it is out of reach of potentially advanced URM students. Hope they publish and publicize, so that their is equitable access to Algebra 1 in 6th grade.

Most people don’t. There are around 30 kids taking Algebra 1 in 6th grade. It is not a economic thing.

In Loudoun, there are over a hundred students taking algebra 2 in 8th grade, not sure how many were in Algebra 1 in 6th grade.

FCPS has a couple hundred kids taking Algebra II in 8th grade, most of the kids take Geometry during the summer because only around 30 kids take Algebra I jn 6th grade.

Loudoun used to have a simple year end assessment score driven teacher recommended placement process. Now after equity math crept in, that path to algebra1 in 6th grade is hidden. Now, most advance by taking summer geometry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In addition to statistics, data science is an alternative to calculus. FCPS has Data Science 1 & 2, but offered only at few schools like Falls Church HS

It is better to take Statistics after calculus. AP classes are supposedly algebra based, but they miss the underlying fundamentals.

What is covered in Data science that’s not in other math classes?

Taking AP stats after calculus won't magically make it calculus-based, so it doesn't matter whether you take it before or after.

Here are some comments on "data science" as a highschool course from Stanford's director of math undergraduate studies, Biran Conrad: https://sites.google.com/view/publiccommentsonthecmf/#h.w46loj4uaiev

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In addition to statistics, data science is an alternative to calculus. FCPS has Data Science 1 & 2, but offered only at few schools like Falls Church HS

It is better to take Statistics after calculus. AP classes are supposedly algebra based, but they miss the underlying fundamentals.

What is covered in Data science that’s not in other math classes?

Data Science is a equity math alternative for students who may find algebra 2 challenging
"...data science — a mix of math, statistics and computer science without widely agreed upon high school standards. Allowing data science, the universities said, was an “equity issue” that could send more students to college. But it also raised concerns that some teenagers would be channeled into less challenging coursework, limiting their opportunities once they got there."
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/13/us/california-math-data-science-algebra.html

Data Science is a great option for kids who want more math but are not interested in calculus, which is most of the population. . I had Algebra, Geometry, and Algebra II in high school. I didn’t take a math my senior year. I have never had calculus but I have a PhD. I have used and taught advanced statistics without ever having calculus.

There are multiple paths for people in math. Calculus and beyond is not the end all and be all. There is nothing wrong with recognizing that.

My child will most likely be taking Algebra 1 H in 7th grade and will end up taking beyond calculus, he loves math. He has his path and that is great.

Do you know how to get a distribution given its CDF, or vice versa? Do you know what a moment generating function is? What field is your PhD in?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is taking precal in 9th grade a good idea? Then calc in 10th. Then you can take diff eq and multivar. Then linear algebra and stats. And take all of them again in college?

Or don't retake them at schools that either accept the credit or allow you to place out of them (e.g. UVA or UIUC), or take a more rigorous proof-based version (e.g. 375 at UWisconsin)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Consider the equity issues that math acceleration creates among high school graduates where one student graduates with Calc BC or Multivariable, and another student finishes just Algebra 2 by senior year. That's an equity gap of 3 to 4 years. If we raise the minimum math for HS graduation to something like a precalculus or calc AB, we would see a lot to high school drop outs. But the advanced math students can easily slow down and graduate with Algebra 2, and instead take other math courses like Statistics or Data Analysis or Math modelling, but stay away from calculus or even precalculus.

What if student is interested in both Calculus as well as Statistics courses? DC has been interested in Economics since middle school, and likes both.

Have them take BC calc and then a calc-based probability and statistics course. Also important is a course in proofs (which happens to be the discrete math course at Virginia Community Colleges). https://courses.vccs.edu/courses/MTH-Mathematics 288 and 283.

But before that, he can read some pop-econ books like The Armchair Economics or The Undercover Economist or The Undercover Economist Strikes Back or The Worldly Philosophers (a bit heavier) or Economics for the Common Good.

[Anonymous]

Also, introductory econ books are terrible. When he takes his first AP or college micro econ course, make sure ha has a real book like Perloff to look at so he can see it isn't as BS as the course makes it seem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In addition to statistics, data science is an alternative to calculus. FCPS has Data Science 1 & 2, but offered only at few schools like Falls Church HS

It is better to take Statistics after calculus. AP classes are supposedly algebra based, but they miss the underlying fundamentals.

What is covered in Data science that’s not in other math classes?

Data Science is a great option for kids who want more math but are not interested in calculus, which is most of the population. . I had Algebra, Geometry, and Algebra II in high school. I didn’t take a math my senior year. I have never had calculus but I have a PhD. I have used and taught advanced statistics without ever having calculus.

What topics are "advanced statistics" ?

When did you do your PhD?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In addition to statistics, data science is an alternative to calculus. FCPS has Data Science 1 & 2, but offered only at few schools like Falls Church HS

It is better to take Statistics after calculus. AP classes are supposedly algebra based, but they miss the underlying fundamentals.

What is covered in Data science that’s not in other math classes?

Data Science is a great option for kids who want more math but are not interested in calculus, which is most of the population. . I had Algebra, Geometry, and Algebra II in high school. I didn’t take a math my senior year. I have never had calculus but I have a PhD. I have used and taught advanced statistics without ever having calculus.

What topics are "advanced statistics" ?

When did you do your PhD?

Regression, Logit, Probit, Simultaneous Equations, and other statistical methodologies. You can learn when and how to use different techniques without being able to prove them. Sage Publication has a great series of books that walks through various techniques that discuss when to use them, how to use them, the diagnostics to check that there is not an issue with your data, and how to correct your data if there is an issue. The books include the proofs and explain the proofs but you can skip that to get to the how to use the method properly.

Probability and stats can be understood and used without calculus. Plenty of fields in academics don’t require calculus. The people in the AAP forum tend to be fully locked into STEM that they don’t understand that most fields don’t require calculus. Most kids don’t take it because it is a hard class and they don’t like math that much.

There are many successful career paths in life that don’t require calculus.

[Anonymous]

For kids that learn and practice indepth math starting in elementary grades and continue throughout middle-school, calculus comes naturally. Think Asian students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For kids that learn and practice indepth math starting in elementary grades and continue throughout middle-school, calculus comes naturally. Think Asian students.

All Asian kids end up in Calculus or the Asian system has a series of tests that track kids into different programs at different ages and the kids not tracked to the college prep high schools don’t end up taking calculus.

European and Asian countries run their schools very differently. There is not a requirement to serve all students like there is in the US. I know that special education services outside the US tend to be far more sparse. I know the tracking is ES, MS, and HS outside the US is very different. Many people in this forum are acting as if the US system tracks the same way that other countries do and we just don’t. I also suspect that the percentage of students completing calculus ends up being similar just that the US has not moved the non-college prep kids out of the same school building.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For kids that learn and practice indepth math starting in elementary grades and continue throughout middle-school, calculus comes naturally. Think Asian students.

By Asian students, I mean Asian American students.